ThePumpkins.net

So here's a thread about the brilliant UK-musician Steven Wilson and all of his projects from Porcupine Tree over No-Man, Bass Communion, IEM, Blackfield and his solo music.
Discuss everything and anything in here.

OK...response to epitome from the "What are you lestening to..." thread:


I didnt know that they sold the Insurgentes Outtake EP seperatley, but I'm glad you received it, it's as great as the album, you've got everything there (from insane noise experiments to "The 78"). This shows how able SW really is.

Yes, I bought the european special edition of In Absentia (incl. an Outtake EP) and the Deadwing singles and compiled myself "Recordings II"..."Half-light" is really beautiful (and very, very, very No-Man-esque ) and I really can't see a reason why they left "Drown with me" off In Absentia. On my 2007 show, SW said it was left for "Wedding nails" before performing it....why???. I could never stand "wedding nails"...
Haha, after your post, I made an "Outtake-check" album by album...here's my list:
"On the sunday of life" -> "Yellow Hedgerow Dreamscapes"
"Up the downstair" -> "Voyage 34" / "Staircase Infinities"
"The Sky moves Sideways" -> "The SE Bonus Disc"
"Signify" -> "Insignificance" / "Metanoia"
"Stupid Dream" "Lightbulb Sun" -> "Recordings"
"In Absentia" "Deadwing" -> Singles and "In Absentia Bonus Disc"
"Fear of a blank planet" -> "Nil Reurring"
"The Incident" -> "Remeber me lover EP"
...I hope, I mentioned them all.

Here's another interesting point in PT:
Did you know that SW can't stand some PT albums?
He really dislikes "The Sky Moves Sideways" for being to floydy and too close to Wish you were here in structure...which is insane, because the album is so much, much better than Wish you were here, it also has some techno elements which clearly have nothing to do with Pink Floyd.
And the other album is "Lightbulb Sun" for having too much so-called "undercrafted" songs....that's also bulls**t imo.
I think all of the songs (even the readiopop of "The rest will flow") are exactly where they are supposed to be and the album really gets more and more...well, narrow somehow in reaching "Russia on ice" which is THE climax ever on any album ever recorded. It makes totally sense in my opinion.

Have we talked about the future of PT, yet?
In my opinion The Incident seemed like the ending of their current era, and they'll bring up something totally new like they did with "In Absentia" after "Lightbulb Sun"...that's just a feeling of mine, but latley I've really gotten excited about the idea...it would be really cool if PT would screw up everything and make a crazy experimental prog rock album ....but that's just a wish, I think they'll stay close to their structures.

Which drummer did you like more? I'd definitley go with Chris Maitland who grooved a lot...Gavin Harrison is too perfect and accurate for my taste....he's a great live drummer....but, well...a bit lifeless. I prefer jazzer like Jimmy Chamberlin to be honest and I think the only thing PT really lacks sometimes is a grooving and more independant drummer.

I have all those out-take CDs and EPs, apart from Metanoia. I've heard it and it seemed a bit pointless to me. It's just a big jam session - and sure, it sounds quite good, but a lot of that was developed into music on Signify, so I can't see me listening to Metanoia all that much... I dunno, maybe I'll try and get hold of it one day.

I remember reading that SW was unhappy with being classed as "the new Pink Floyd" after releasing The Sky Moves Sideways, so I can see him being unhappy with that album because of that, but if he's unhappy with the music on there he's mad!
In fact, you mention TSMS and Lightbulb Sun as the two albums he wasn't happy with... and they're my two favourites! I agree with what you said about Lightbulb Sun. Russia on Ice is one of my favourite PT tracks, and followed by the awesome Feel So Low, another of my favourites and a great way to end the album.

I know you aren't too keen on The Incident, but I like it a lot - follows on from the metal style of FOABP, but mixes in bits from each other PT era (well, except the trancey stuff).
As much as I like the prog-metal approach on the last 2 albums (and it was kind of present on Deadwing too), I am hoping they switch styles for the next album. They've never kept the same style for more than 2 or 3 albums in a row, and that's something I really like about them.
I think I've mentioned this to you before though: with them now being on Roadrunner Records, I'm worried that they will be bullied into sticking with a similar style. SW is all about the music though, so I doubt he can be easily pushed around in that way.

They're both great drummers. I think I'd go for Gavin Harrison, to be honest. Amazing drummer, in my opinion.
Speaking of Gavin Harrison - he drums on the latest OSI album (although it's not as good as their previous 2 albums)... have you ever listened to OSI?

Oh, I was going to ask what your tracklist for your In Absentia/Deadwing out-takes album is... here's mine:

1. Revenant
2. So Called Friend
3. Orchidia
4. Futile
5. Novak (actually from Lightbulb Sun, but not on Recordings)
6. Meantime
7. Drown with Me
8. Mother And Child Divided
9. Chloroform
10. Is Not
11. Half Light

I included a couple of tracks from the Futile CD, which were essentially In Absentia out-takes as well.

I also compiled an EP of earlier rarities - I have them all on the Stars Die 'Best of' double CD. They're all from around the Up The Downstair to Signify era:

1. Fuse The Sky
2. Colourflow in Mind
3. Phantoms
4. Signify II
5. Stars Die
6. Men of Wood
7. The Sound Of No-One Listening

Well, I haven't listened to OSI, yet, but thanks for the recommention!

Metanoia isn't really essential and I've only listened a few times to it...but for the sake of completeness... .

My Stars Die compilation has exactly the same tracks in another order, but my "Recordings II" is morely an EP:
1. Revenant
2. Chloroform
3. Futile
4. London (it's stupid dream era - I know)
5. Drown with me
6. Novak
7. So-called friend
8. Half-light
...it's short but the flow is fine!

And...it's funny, but I gave The Incident another spin and it has grown a bit on me. It's not as horrible as I remembered it, but still the very weakest of all PT albums to me with a long distance to Deadwing and In Absentia which I used to consider the weakest before The Incident.
It still lacks all the surprises I expected a PT album to have, but it's an alright listen if you're in the mood for some "light-mature" music. And of course it's still above these days' album avarage. But the only really outstanding songs are still "Time flies" and "Remember me lover"...the rest should maybe have been worked out a bit longer, I dunno....And "Octane Twisted/The Seance" is still a rip-off of No-Man's 2003 "Break up for real"...and that's lame somehow!

Hmmm... London - don't think I've heard that one - and I thought I had all PT's stuff! Is it a Stupid Dream b-side that didn't go on Recordings then?

Yup, it's a totally different and much more melancholic alternate version of "Don't hate me" with a total different chorus.

Ah, cool... I have just found it... although if you have a higher quality version than the 128k MP3 I have, feel free to send it over

Pretty cool song that, I'll add it to my "Recordings II" album!

What would be a good first PT album to get?

Me and Don both answered this in the Listening To thread, as ryon also asked... they have quite a lot of variety, so it really depends what style you want to go for, I think. As me and Don both rate Lightbulb Sun very highly, I guess that can't be a bad place to start! But it's one of their more "traditional" albums, not as proggy or experimental as most of their stuff, so maybe not the best representation of their usual style.

EDIT:
Just had a thought - they have a few live albums, so any of those might be decent places to start, as they'll have tracks of various albums (but being live it shouldn't sound as disjointed as a compilation album).

Wow, here's a new SW interview that shows how mature this man really is...very interesting:

ptontour.tripod.com/swfbinterview.html

Very good interview (still have the end of it to read, but got to go for a bit).

I enjoyed his comments about religion - I was never too sure of his views on it before, but it turns out that's yet another thing we have in common.

Also, his comments about his favourite period of rock music being 67-77. Now, I don't agree with that exactly, as I wasn't even alive then and haven't heard most of what was released then (plus, even if I did it wouldn't be from the same perspective). But I do agree with (and have said the same thing before) that there's really nothing new to do in music anymore. To some degree, it's probably the same with cinema and TV. So much has already been done it's almost impossible to come up with something new.

Also very pleasing to hear that he's a good way through a new solo album. He mentions having a lot of guest musicians on it... I guess that could be good or bad - depends who they are and how they're used, I suppose.

I also think SW's opinion towards religion is very farsighted, I already liked his statements concerning reiligion on Signify and this interview proofed that he seems to be quiet critical towards any religion which is a good thing these days, I think. I'm not that excited by any religion and the way it controles the people myself.

I really don't know if the rock music period of the 60s and 70s was the best, I think (as proofed by original Pumpkins) there also was a wide ranging and exciting landscape in the 90s.
But that's right, there's not much more left to do now.
The only directions that could bring up something new are experimental rock, noise rock and post rock in my opinion.


I am really looking foreward to the new solo album, especially if it's really becoming that dark and calm as announced, that sounds really interesting to me and we both now that this potentially might become as genious as usually . I don't mind the guest musicians as long as they bring themselves helpfully in and don't ruin the vision SW had.
And it seems like there also have some preparations been made for a next No-Man release after the solo album which also is good thing to me.

Never asked that before but lyrically, which is your favorite album by PT?
I'd definitly go with Fear of a blank planet because that's a damned important topic if you like at the next gen's kids (I'm mid 20s). They really seem mostly to suffer from disorders, addictions and awfully wrong bevavior and general boredom. That's sad but true and they way it's been reworked on this album is definitley sadening but it shows the true siginificance of the the topic. Just read the lyrics of track#1. It's a slap in the face of every teenager and that's the way it's supposed to be.

I am really looking forward to the new solo album too - I hadn't really heard much about it before, so it's nice to hear he's made quite a lot of progress with it already. Do you think we'll see it late this year, or am I being too hopeful?

He sure is one of the hardest working musicians around these days. A new Porcupine Tree album every 2-3 years, and there's rarely a year goes by that there isn't a release from at least one of his projects. And on top of that he does a lot of producing and mastering/re-mastering for other bands too. BC should take notes

I do find SW's lyrics to be a bit hit and miss - usually they're good, but sometimes he'll have some clunky lines in there. Deadwing had some very good music, but a lot of the lyrics seemed pretty bad to me.

FOABP is very good lyrically. I'm 29 and grumpy, so it suits me quite well I also love the dark, melancholy lyrics on Lightbulb Sun and I think I'd probably pick that as my favourite.

Hey, I just checked out Steve Wilson and Porcupine Tree out of curiosity after seeing this thread, and they're amazing! I can't believe I've never heard their music before! Love it!

Great, I'm glad you liked it! Porcupine Tree are definitely one of the best bands around, in my opinion - I love that there's so much variety as well (especially if you count all the various bands SW is part of)

They're pretty cool. I haven't listened to much but "Fear Of The Blank Planet" reminds me of Tool.

Aww... I like Coldplay...

I've always enjoyed that photo

SW's right on Coldplay .
But he really used to mention mid-90s-Pumpkins as source of inspiration once which is a good thing for us !

Wow, many PT newcomers here .
Hey Ryon & EasternMind :
Keep on Fear of a blank planet! The album is totally brilliant!
Give some different PT albums a spin, you really won't regret it.


Other cool statement of SW: He was asked questions concerning production values and the interviewer asked him about his opinion at the Death Magnetic Metallica album which is supposed to be produced far too loud.
He just stares at the cam, looking very confused, and states: "Well, I DO NOT listen to Metallica and all that crap!" Then he starts laughing That really made my day back in 2008.



Hey Epitome:

I think SW-solo Part II is a perfect x-mas album, isn' it? SW usually works very quick and hard.
Billy should really take notes and work more straight, but well, he's got the money, so he can even give away his songs for free (looking at their quality, yet, I wouldn't call this a wonder at all .
SW would probably kill himself before he stops releasing proper albums for starting releasing EP-track MP3s at 192kbit/s for free download on his bandsite

Your right about some lyrics (especially Deadwing seems to be a bit miss at times), but I really, really love his "Open Car" lyrics.
Lord, SW must hate sex .
But on the other hand I also like those dirty and erotic lyrics he wrote in the In Absentai era a lot ("Drown with me" "Gravity eyelids" "Blackest Eyes"), they really belong into the music of that songs.
Yes, Lightbulb Sun, of course, those melancholic lyrics are just brilliant. A friend of mine (he's also in Pumpkins) called Lightbulb Sun Porcupine Tree's Adore .